VSKsailing.rocks

Group:
Race #: 1
Time (in Replay): 2 :24
Rule(s) applicable: 24.1
Skipper(s) involved: A2Mover
Description:
Print Screen attached: Y
Replay attached: N
Type: Protest + Redress

1.Your registered Boat Name: Albervita It Wolves (Marino IT Wolves)

2.Race Day:4

3.Group (colour):Blue

4.Race (number):1

5.Time (in Replay):2:24

6.Rule(s) applicable: 24.1

7.Boat(s) involved: A2Mover

8.Description: At start A2Mover get 30.1 ; in the attempt to come back Marino gets a 16.1 . Since A2Mover did not start he should not interfere with Marino who was starting properly. Then A2 Mover started and did his 360, so did Marino.
Marino should be entitled to a Redress.

9.Print Screen attached (required for a manual protest): Y

10.Replay attached (recommended): N

(BatBoat on behalf of A2-Mover). Before the start, Marino has established overlap leeward to A2-Mover. As A2-Mover changes course, Marino hits A2. Immediately before the collision, Marino has changed course. Marino should as right-of-way boat when changing course, give A2-Mover room to keep clear.

Marino should be DSQ, cf. rule 16.1.

It should also be noted that rule 22.1 as Marino implies, does not apply, since A2-Mover is not sailing towards the pre-start side of the starting line (yet).

Strange reconstruction Batboat. It seems that you saw another replay.
1. Batboat did not start (30.1)ed so he should avoid any interference with other boats.
2. Instead of doing reasonable attempt to avoid interference (going straight or relasing sails) A2Mover tries to tack very quickly without giving time to Marino to react thus colliding and moreover on port tack interfering (with another contact that should have been also sanctioned) with Donmasino.
3. At any time Marino did his best to avoid collision either with Zee Pol (also 30.1) and with A2mover. So the request of DSQ seems very inappropriate.
4. Note that Marino did not ask A2mover being DSQ (this is the PC task) but simply to be granted a redress.

Facts:
Marino 2 boat widths to leeward of A2-Mover.
Marino luffs to 1 boat with from A2-mover, then starts bearing away.
A2-mover luffs hard, and her stern hits Marino.
Marino got a penalty from the VSK umpire under rule 16.1.
Marino protests A2-Mover.
Both boats takes a penalty turn.

Conclusion:
Marino gave A2-Mover room to keep clear, no rules broken by him.
A2-mover did not keep clear and broke rule 11.
Marino is not entitled to redress, as none of the criteria's for redress are met.
Marino to have +1 point added to her score for filing a protest that is not upheld (MLS Rule 3.3.4).

Note:
Why protest a boat that has taken a penalty turn?
What was the reason for requesting redress? Marino's 360?
Marino could have cancelled the penalty if he didn't break a rule.

MLS Protest Committee

Dear PC,
No mention at all that A2Mover made all manouvers after a false start.
However , MLS rules says "3.6.1 At any time during a race or after the race, a boat participating in the same race or the PC can protest another boat under Rule 2. This changes RRS 61.1 (a)."
Regarding the subsequent action of A2Mover towards Donmasino that I recall above I must record the embarassing silence of PC.
Thx
Albervita

What do you mean by embarassing? If something is embarrassing, then it's those who don't bother to file a protest on their own, then complain that the protest committee didn't file a protest for them.

Donmasino could have protested on the water if he claimed A2-mover broke a rule.
Or If you thought this was a rule 2 violation, then any of you could protested after the race without hailing P on the water.

The situation is NOT an obvious rule 2 violation, hence it's not something the PC has as a policy to protest for.
A2-Mover makes a mistake tacking in front of Donmasino, but he realizes it's a mistake and tries to tack back.
That is a rules violation, but not an obvious deliberate action!
Had he continued on port, ignoring Donmasino, then it would have been a breach of rule 2.

Regards Harald,
MLS Protest Committee Chairman

Ok Harald ,
we could argue for months.
Still I have a question : did A2mover comply with RRS22.1 ?
22.1 A boat sailing towards the pre-start side of the starting line or one of
its extensions after her starting signal to start or to comply with rule
30.1 shall keep clear of a boat not doing so until she is completely on
the pre-start side.

In my opinion he did not comply and the collision with Donmasino is evident. PC has the choice to intervene or not . I just record that in this case PC did not.
Regards
Alberto

No problem if people have different opinion. That's not embarrassing.

Rule 22.1 begins to apply the moment the boat is sailing towards the starting line. If the starting line is 90 degrees to the wind, this happens when the boat goes below TWA 90. That's a fact. For Donmasino that fact doesn't matter, as A2-Mover didn't have right of way with Donmasino anyway, since he passed HTW. But the case we looked at was the contact between A2-Mover and Marino, which did not force A2-Mover to tack, so it was separate from the Donmasino case.

Regards,
Harald

Dear Protest Committee
I wanted to understand why Zee pol's maneuver was not verified at start

In the Green group race 1 this PC write
Note:
The protest committee has as a policy to protest any potential rule 2 violations that comes to our attention while watching replays to process other cases.
What is the difference between the two cases

Thanks for the attention

Hi Rosario,

The difference is that Zee had right of way, while Clande did not have right of way.
A boat is only "barging" if she doesn't have right of way.
If Zee is breaking a rule with Marino, it's only rule 16.1, not rule 2.

If Marino want to protest Zee, then he write "P Zee" in the chat. In this case Marino would have been very close to getting penalized under rule 11, because he is not doing much to keep clear during 3.5 seconds on a collision course with Zee.

Harald